Posts by skiaouros


    Two Salve Regina, #1 ZWV140 and #2 ZWV136, are available at, manuscripts Mus2358-E-14-1&2. Mp3s and scores are in the repository.

    #1 : S in cantus firmus above unleashed ATB, a gem well hidden behind the faded staves.
    #2 : mix of Solo and Choir with peculiar ornamentation.


    The pdf of a book about Ristori by Curt Rudolf Mengelberg is available here :…/Giovanni_Alberto_Ristori
    It was published in 1916, before many manuscripts were lost.

    It contains some examples including excerpts of a Gloria (p.90), a Requiem (p.102), a Stabat Mater (p.123), and a list of the works (p.142).
    Curiously the Requiem excerpt is a rework of the ZWV46 beginning, with different orchestration and string/woodwind arrangement, very nice.
    It looks like the borrowings from his colleague are common as in the Messa per il Santissimo Natale.
    From the Stabat Mater we have a lovely fugue on Quando corpus morietur,
    at least it seems not from JDZ.

    Thanks to djdresden for sharing his interest in Ristori.


    I had the luck to listen to this Kyrie, beautiful ! Thank you Nikolay.
    Yet another style of interpretation of Zelenka, I like the Agnus Dei very much.

    The suspicion seems correct :
    It is easy to follow the Lacrimosa with the Kyrie II score, slightly modified themes, same themes entries, same cadences, same construction, a few mesures removed, but completely different interpretations with a soft Lacrimosa and vivacious Kyrie II / Dona nobis.

    Another huge effort with ZWV2 (Gloria, Credo), and the Missa Judica Me would be complete. (ZWV26 is supposed to be its Kyrie, ZWV30 is a rework of its Gloria)



    A new concert at the end of this year :

    Christmas Mass of J. D. Zelenka / Missa Nativitatis Domini D major
    Casting: Musica Florea Baroque orchestra, choir, solo singers
    Conductor: Marek Štryncl
    4.12. Jablonec nad Nisou
    7.12. Prague, Church of St. Simon and Juda, Dušní street

    " The next religious Zelenka´s opus Musica Florea has been preparing is Missa Nativitatis Domini in D major. It comes from the middle period of his active years and it has not been yet professionally recorded. "
    ... except by the Marburger Bachchor ? (Genuin GEN 11213)

    As mentioned earlier in this forum, this mass has been previously performed by the Prague Cathedral Choir (



    Here is how I searched the catalog:
    - to change the language to english : St George's Cross flag at the bottom left
    - Collections : Music department
    - About music department
    - catalogue of the collection of handwritings and old prints up to and including 1983
    - search "Zelenka"
    - You need Java installed. To have bigger pictures : Menü/Hilfe->Anzeigegröße ändern->...
    The cards can be printed with "Drucken", I printed all cards (von Bild Nr. bis Nr.) in one pdf.
    - advance 9 times +10, 3 times +1,
    - Here you should have 2358-D15, it is writen :
    the Gloria misses the "Gratias agimus" up to "Filius Patris amen"
    the end fugue of the Gloria "Cum Sancto spiritu", previously 2358-D-80, was put back in 1979

    Also :
    - if you have the opportunity, ask about any new Zelenka manuscript (from Moscow...).
    - at the Zentralbibliothek Mediathek there is a lot of material (search result # in general catalog SLUB-Katalog) :
    #138 un unpublished audio recording (Tonbandkassette) of the mass Purificationis ZWV16
    #147 ZWV20 to compare with the manuscripts and read the editor comments in German.
    #181 a Requiem
    - copies of transcriptions of unpublished works edited by (pages 70-73 of catalog) should be available.

    Never been there, lucky you !



    From 12/5 to 4/6 2010 :
    Sat 29, Musica Florea (Marek Stryncl conductor) :
    Program :
    * Jan Dismas Zelenka: Da Pacem Domine, ZWV 167
    * Jan Dismas Zelenka: „De Profundis“, psalm 130 in d, ZWV 50
    * Antonín Rejcha: Requiem

    At last a rare work ZWV167 !
    Let's hope the official radio Vltava ( will broadcast it.

    Radio Proglas is another partner. (…y-pro-letosni-rocnik.html)
    It seems that they participated to an International Choral Festival "Bohemia Cantat 2009" where Marek Štryncl conducted the psalm 125 "In convertendo" (ZWV91) (
    Both scores are published in the Editio Supraphon, 1990, and have mp3 mock ups in the repository.



    Interesting question that would require a full analysis of the harmony in the piece, (beginning very similar to prelude BWV847) here are some unsure points :

    1) Layout of the work (x : X minor, X : X major):
    1. Miserere I : c-v (v = dominant of c : g)
    2. Miserere II : C
    3. Gloria Patri I : e
    4. Gloria Patri II : Cv-v (Cv = G, ends on dominant = D)
    5. Sicut erat : C-v
    6. Miserere II : c-v

    2) The key has two flats (Dorian notation) as for G minor, although the C minor is the first established tonality. Two comments : first the theory of key notation wasn't fixed at that time, the number of accidents may vary. Also as G minor (dominant of C minor) is mainly used, the notation is more simple.

    3) The main cadences are on 'us' of Deus : ms 24, 29 : in C minor.

    4) In the bass, on most G, the figured bass includes the C in inverted chords.

    5) It seems to be an exploitation of the harmonic modulation between tonic and dominant, giving an expansion/elevation effect, like a long dominant pedal. Used inside the movement, and between the pieces.



    I uploaded some mockups at :

    - Mus.2455-O-1 : Concerto for oboe in Eb by Giovanni Alberto Ristori

    - Mus.2421-O-15 : Concerto in eb by Pisendel

    - Mus.2389-O-49 : Concerto for two violins RV508 by Vivaldi, re-scored by Pisendel who added oboes and bassoons.

    - Mus.2468-O-1 : Concerto in D for violin and bassoon by Francesco Maria Cattaneo
    - Mus.2468-O-2 : Concerto in A for violin by F.M. Cattaneo

    - Mus.3701-O-1 : Concerto in G for flauto traverso by Johann Adam

    - Mus.2375-R-1 : Sonata in A for violin by Franz (Francesco) Hunt


    Found in Understanding Bach, 3, 80-82 © Bach Network UK 2008
    New Perspectives on the Canons of Johann Sebastian Bach, ELISE CREAN
    "Another example of Bach’s innate skill in developing the compositional ideas of his
    predecessors and contemporaries to new levels of erudition and complexity is the series of
    interval canons in the Goldberg Variations (BWV 988). Yo Tomita has convincingly suggested
    that a manuscript belonging to Jan Dismas Zelenka, which contains a set of eleven interval
    canons by Johann Joseph Fux followed by nine of Zelenka’s own, may have provided the
    model for Bach’s work. Yo Tomita, ‘Bach and Dresden: A New Hypothesis on the Origin of
    the Goldberg Variations (BWV 988)’, in Music and Theology: Essays in Honor of Robin A. Leaver,
    ed. Daniel Zager (Lanham, Maryland: Scarecrow Press, 2007) pp. 169–92. Bach not only
    constructs a series that uses an organisational principle similar to that of their ‘fairly
    straightforward compositional exercises’ (Tomita, p. 177) but also generates a structural
    framework for the composition through the placement of an interval canon on every third

    I listened again the Lutheran masses by Bach (by Herreweghe), maybe there is something in the Gloria of BWV234, the Cum sancto spiritu of BWV236...

    Reading about Wilhelm Friedemann Bach (whose melodic line of the Fk 65 adagio was copied by W.A.Mozart and appear in his Requiem's Recordare), I found a citation of Zelenka in the booklet of CD Harmonia mundi 901772 :
    "W.F. Bach's professional career began in 1733 [to 1746] as organist of the Sophienkirche in Dresden, a badly paid post that was once disparagingly described by the violonist Johann Georg Pisendel as a place of penitence, but which did leave the composer time for a variety of activities of his own - such as appearances at musical soirées at the electoral court or in the houses of music-loving aristocrats. Amongst the works he wrote in Dresden is the Sinfonia in F major (Fk 67), whose capricious fast movements owe a debt to the instrumental style of Jan Dismas Zelenka, whilst the Andante recalls types of aria in the Dresden operas of Johann Adolph Hasse".

    Johann SK

    It inspire me that it requires better than a 'second couteau' oboist.
    I did the whole concerto, it should be very galant, forgive my oboist...

    Let's now see another manuscript... Pisendel Mus.2421-O-15, a nice concerto for Violin in e-moll.

    Thanks for the anecdote,